To Mack, Okay, here goes...

Posted by ROB T. from 162.10.138.28 on May 28, 1999 at 01:19:39:

In Reply to: To Rob T. posted by Mack on May 27, 1999 at 17:26:16:

: I am 19. Star Wars has been in my veins since birth. But his isn't really important. Many members of my inner circle of Star Wars fans first watched Star Wars at the original '77 release. These people are seasoned Star Wars veterans, and they all LOVE the movie. They love practically everything about it. We found that this movie not only met, but exceeded our expectations. Why are a lot of people dissapointed?

Hey Mack, ROB T. Here,

I don't want to just rehash the same points that I made in my little mini-review of "Phantom Menace." You read it and we agree to disagree about our differing opinion of the films merit. Instead I'm gonna touch on the two scenes that everyone agrees are the best in the film and explain why even these scenes were a bit of a disappointment for me.
But first, you asked why I think people were disappointed with this film. A lot of people on the web (mostly the people who loved "PM") have said that the rest of us just expected too much. That the hype was so high that no film could live up to it and we set ourselves up for disappointment by setting our standards at an unreachable level. I don't agree. Even if you remove the hype and the collective anticipation of waiting all these years for this movie and just compare it to the other "Star Wars" films and apply the same criterion you'd apply to any non-"Star Wars" flick, "Phantom Menace" comes out weak.
I already mentioned in my earlier review how I felt about the script, the CGI effects, Jar Jar, and the general quality of the movie so here I'll just focus on two scenes; the pod race and the final lightsaber duel.

The pod race first... A lot of critics, even the ones who didn't like the movie have said they found the pod race to be impressive and have compared it to the chariot race in "Ben Hur." I don't know if you've seen "Ben Hur" but you should check it out. I here this comparison and I have to wonder if these critics have ever seen "Ben Hur" on the big screen or if they've just caught it on video. I don't believe there is a real comparison. "Ben Hur" has an incredible chariot race that lasts for 14 minutes of screentime and includes lots of dangerous crashes, fantastic visuals and some amazing stuntwork.
The pod race in "Phantom Menace" is certainly fast-paced but because it looks like it was filmed on a computer, it doesn't pull you into the story. All the competitors look like cartoon characters and the whole thing just seems like a big video game. If I had to compare it to a chariot race in another film I would not choose "Ben Hur" but would instead choose the chariot race in "Prince of Egypt." In "Ben Hur" even the massive crowd of spectators looks real because it was real. You see the film and are constantly awed thinking, "How in the hell did they do that?" In "Phantom Menace" I never once had that. I could tell right off that it was all done on computer because it just didn't have a real feel about it.

The second scene I'd like to pick apart is the fateful lightsaber duel at the end. If you compare it to the duel between Luke and Vader in "Empire" it doesn't seem as impressive as people keep saying. I agree that it was acrobatic and the martial arts aspect of it was great. Two things were missing. First I thight it was lacking in close-ups of the actors. So much of it was shot at a distance so all the actors could be kept track of that the audience is kept out of the action.
More importantly, the scene was lacking in emotional depth. Remember the fight between Vader and Luke, especially toward the end. Luke has been knocked through the big window and now nobody knows where Vader is. Luke is looking for him and we know he'll be back. Didn't you jump when Vader came out of nowhere and went at Luke with all the fury of the Dark side. Their battling on that catwalk and Vader hacks off Luke's arm. Now Luke is weaponless and injured and backed into a corner. Vader turns off his lightsaber and extends his hand to Luke. With nowhere to go Luke keeps backing up further and further out above that bottomless abyss. Then Vader drops the big bombshell. The most evil creature in the galaxy says, "I'm your father."
Luke at first doesn't believe it yet he feels drawn to this monster. Injured and in shock, he knows he can't resist the power of the Dark side so he does the only thing he can do. He jumps.
Wow. That is powerful stuff and it far outdoes the emotionless battle in "Phantom Menace."

In the end, I can't tell you why everyone was disappointed in "Phantom Menace." I can only say why I was. I felt that the film was a near-miss. All the parts were there for a masterful film and maybe in the hands of another director things would have been different. Imagine how the movie would have been if directed by Spielberg.
Lucas just wasn't up to the task of bringing his vision to the screen.
But I don't want to heap to much acid on this film. It wasn't horrible and I sure as hell couldn't have done a better job myself. I just can't help thinking that it could have been so much better if only...

Incidentally, Mack, I didn't mean to single you out as kind of the "Phantom Menace" apologist on this site. It's only that you seem to be the most vocal about defending the movie. I'm glad that you liked the film as much as you did. I only wish I felt the same.

I'd like to hear your opinion on the points I made here. That is if you read the whole thing. I realize this was a pretty long post.

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: : I am 19. Star Wars has been in my veins since birth. But his isn't really important. Many members of my inner circle of Star Wars fans first watched Star Wars at the original '77 release. These people are seasoned Star Wars veterans, and they all LOVE the movie. They love practically everything about it. We found that this movie not only met, but exceeded our expectations. Why are a lot of people dissapointed?

: Hey Mack, ROB T. Here,

:   I don't want to just rehash the same points that I made in my little mini-review of "Phantom Menace." You read it and we agree to disagree about our differing opinion of the films merit. Instead I'm gonna touch on the two scenes that everyone agrees are the best in the film and explain why even these scenes were a bit of a disappointment for me.
:   But first, you asked why I think people were disappointed with this film. A lot of people on the web (mostly the people who loved "PM") have said that the rest of us just expected too much. That the hype was so high that no film could live up to it and we set ourselves up for disappointment by setting our standards at an unreachable level. I don't agree. Even if you remove the hype and the collective anticipation of waiting all these years for this movie and just compare it to the other "Star Wars" films and apply the same criterion you'd apply to any non-"Star Wars" flick, "Phantom Menace" comes out weak. 
:   I already mentioned in my earlier review how I felt about the script, the CGI effects, Jar Jar, and the general quality of the movie so here I'll just focus on two scenes; the pod race and the final lightsaber duel.

:   The pod race first... A lot of critics, even the ones who didn't like the movie have said they found the pod race to be impressive and have compared it to the chariot race in "Ben Hur." I don't know if you've seen "Ben Hur" but you should check it out. I here this comparison and I have to wonder if these critics have ever seen "Ben Hur" on the big screen or if they've just caught it on video. I don't believe there is a real comparison. "Ben Hur" has an incredible chariot race that lasts for 14 minutes of screentime and includes lots of dangerous crashes, fantastic visuals and some amazing stuntwork.
:   The pod race in "Phantom Menace" is certainly fast-paced but because it looks like it was filmed on a computer, it doesn't pull you into the story. All the competitors look like cartoon characters and the whole thing just seems like a big video game. If I had to compare it to a chariot race in another film I would not choose "Ben Hur" but would instead choose the chariot race in "Prince of Egypt." In "Ben Hur" even the massive crowd of spectators looks real because it was real. You see the film and are constantly awed thinking, "How in the hell did they do that?" In "Phantom Menace" I never once had that. I could tell right off that it was all done on computer because it just didn't have a real feel about it.

:   The second scene I'd like to pick apart is the fateful lightsaber duel at the end. If you compare it to the duel between Luke and Vader in "Empire" it doesn't seem as impressive as people keep saying. I agree that it was acrobatic and the martial arts aspect of it was great. Two things were missing. First I thight it was lacking in close-ups of the actors. So much of it was shot at a distance so all the actors could be kept track of that the audience is kept out of the action.
:   More importantly, the scene was lacking in emotional depth. Remember the fight between Vader and Luke, especially toward the end. Luke has been knocked through the big window and now nobody knows where Vader is. Luke is looking for him and we know he'll be back. Didn't you jump when Vader came out of nowhere and went at Luke with all the fury of the Dark side. Their battling on that catwalk and Vader hacks off Luke's arm. Now Luke is weaponless and injured and backed into a corner. Vader turns off his lightsaber and extends his hand to Luke. With nowhere to go Luke keeps backing up further and further out above that bottomless abyss. Then Vader drops the big bombshell. The most evil creature in the galaxy says, "I'm your father."
:   Luke at first doesn't believe it yet he feels drawn to this monster. Injured and in shock, he knows he can't resist the power of the Dark side so he does the only thing he can do. He jumps.
:   Wow. That is powerful stuff and it far outdoes the emotionless battle in "Phantom Menace."

:   In the end, I can't tell you why everyone was disappointed in "Phantom Menace." I can only say why I was. I felt that the film was a near-miss. All the parts were there for a masterful film and maybe in the hands of another director things would have been different. Imagine how the movie would have been if directed by Spielberg.
:   Lucas just wasn't up to the task of bringing his vision to the screen.
:   But I don't want to heap to much acid on this film. It wasn't horrible and I sure as hell couldn't have done a better job myself. I just can't help thinking that it could have been so much better if only...

:   Incidentally, Mack, I didn't mean to single you out as kind of the "Phantom Menace" apologist on this site. It's only that you seem to be the most vocal about defending the movie. I'm glad that you liked the film as much as you did. I only wish I felt the same.

:   I'd like to hear your opinion on the points I made here. That is if you read the whole thing. I realize this was a pretty long post.
:

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