Probably..

Posted by India Jones from tmm-gw1.thmulti.com on June 26, 2001 at 15:22:22:

In Reply to: Re: Yep.. posted by Patterson on June 26, 2001 at 15:07:25:

Yes, this may have been a misunderstanding. It was a phone conversation I had with Peter some time ago where he mentioned that the company that made the original lambskin went out of business some time ago and that the new skins were thinner. I thought that he also said that that's why they don't distress them...but anyway. You're right, the distressing was done by Noel Howard for the movies so maybe there were never any pre-distressed lambs coming from Wested. I'm getting intrigued about this goat thing. So you say that it becomes as soft as lamb with wear. How much wear? Two months? Two years? Does it drape like the lamb when its broken in? Does FS send leather samples? Still, its way too expensive for my budget. I am also enjoying this.

Thanks,
IJ

: The Wested new finish cowhide would be my choice if I were to get a Wested. I still place the Expedition above any Wested I've eve owned or examined. The FS is made to be worn for a very, very long time - I could honestly see myself giving one of these to my son in 20 years.

: Peter actually says he has sold predistressed lambskin?! That is a new one. He's refused to even entertain the idea as long as I've been playing in this sandbox. In fact, every jacket he's ever made for the movies has been provided in brand new condition - something he has always steadfastly held to. He would turn them over to the likes of Noel Howard to do the actual dirty work of distressing them. Maybe you misunderstood him?

: The goatskin jackets I have from FS are perfectly suited for summer wear. Ounce for ounce, goat is supposed to be lighter than lamb, but the skins do tend to be thicker. The overall effect seems to be a goatskin jacket will tend to be about the same weight as a lambskin jacket. I will say from personal experience that lamb seems to breath a bit better than goat, but the difference does not seem to be material to me.

: Goat has a higher fat content? Actually, I've heard they are virtually identical when using high quality skins - which I'm told is more a function of where you are buying your skins. For example, New Zealand lamb is known for it's higher fat content. It is, therefore, suited perfectly to "vintage" applications, as the fat deposits near the surface respond well to commercial techniques that uniformly break that surface to give a predistressed look. My understanding - per conversations with more than just one individual who makes their living at this - is that goat is stiff when new, but relaxes rapidly when worn regularly. The stiffness is not supposed to be from the fat content, but from the effects of a very dense (tough) skin being tanned and finished. It becomes very, very soft with time. I can attest to this, as my FS veg goat is as soft as my Wested lamb ever was - I guess I've had it for 6 months now? It does retain more body to it, i.e. it did not become as "lifeless" as lambskin can. I've noted this with FS lambskin as well - not picking on Wested. My chrome goat has also been coming along quite nicely, and is distressing even better than the veg.

: Hope this helps - Again, check with Noel.

: Patterson

Follow Ups:

Re: Probably.. Patterson 16:01:15 6/26/2001 (9)
- Also... Patterson 16:11:29 6/26/2001 (2)
  - Wow, no wonder why you're the authority on this stuff. How do you afford this expensive hobby? (nm) India Jones 17:03:57 6/26/2001 (1)
    - Well, it is actually cheaper than my father-in-law's golf game ($100+ per week - ouch!), and that's why my wife kinda lets it slide (grin)(nm) Patterson 17:25:24 6/26/2001 (0)
- Hot Damn Austin Powers 16:07:36 6/26/2001 (5)
  - Only thing... Michaelson 16:11:37 6/26/2001 (4)
    - One sure-fire way.... Austin Powers 16:16:01 6/26/2001 (1)
      - Re: One sure-fire way.... Michaelson 16:18:36 6/26/2001 (0)
    - LOL! You've uncovered my plot! Patterson 16:13:49 6/26/2001 (1)
      - It works for a while Michaelson 16:17:09 6/26/2001 (0)

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: Yes, this may have been a misunderstanding.  It was a phone conversation I had with Peter some time ago where he mentioned that the company that made the original lambskin went out of business some time ago and that the new skins were thinner.  I thought that he also said that that's why they don't distress them...but anyway.  You're right, the distressing was done by Noel Howard for the movies so maybe there were never any pre-distressed lambs coming from Wested.  I'm getting intrigued about this goat thing.  So you say that it becomes as soft as lamb with wear.  How much wear?  Two months?  Two years?  Does it drape like the lamb when its broken in?  Does FS send leather samples?  Still, its way too expensive for my budget.  I am also enjoying this.

: Thanks,
: IJ

: : The Wested new finish cowhide would be my choice if I were to get a Wested.  I still place the Expedition above any Wested I've eve owned or examined.  The FS is made to be worn for a very, very long time - I could honestly see myself giving one of these to my son in 20 years.

: : Peter actually says he has sold predistressed lambskin?!  That is a new one.  He's refused to even entertain the idea as long as I've been playing in this sandbox.  In fact, every jacket he's ever made for the movies has been provided in brand new condition - something he has always steadfastly held to.  He would turn them over to the likes of Noel Howard to do the actual dirty work of distressing them.  Maybe you misunderstood him?

: : The goatskin jackets I have from FS are perfectly suited for summer wear.  Ounce for ounce, goat is supposed to be lighter than lamb, but the skins do tend to be thicker.  The overall effect seems to be a goatskin jacket will tend to be about the same weight as a lambskin jacket.  I will say from personal experience that lamb seems to breath a bit better than goat, but the difference does not seem to be material to me.

: : Goat has a higher fat content?  Actually, I've heard they are virtually identical when using high quality skins - which I'm told is more a function of where you are buying your skins.  For example, New Zealand lamb is known for it's higher fat content.  It is, therefore, suited perfectly to "vintage" applications, as the fat deposits near the surface respond well to commercial techniques that uniformly break that surface to give a predistressed look.  My understanding - per conversations with more than just one individual who makes their living at this - is that goat is stiff when new, but relaxes rapidly when worn regularly.  The stiffness is not supposed to be from the fat content, but from the effects of a very dense (tough) skin being tanned and finished.  It becomes very, very soft with time.  I can attest to this, as my FS veg goat is as soft as my Wested lamb ever was - I guess I've had it for 6 months now?  It does retain more body to it, i.e. it did not become as "lifeless" as lambskin can.  I've noted this with FS lambskin as well - not picking on Wested.  My chrome goat has also been coming along quite nicely, and is distressing even better than the veg.

: : Hope this helps - Again, check with Noel.

: : Patterson

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