Re: Not meaning to start anything, but...

Posted by Rundquist from adsl-63-201-187-189.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net (63.201.187.189) on Saturday, February 22, 2003 at 2:29am :

In Reply to: Not meaning to start anything, but... posted by graml from ? (137.155.121.20) on Friday, February 21, 2003 at 4:54pm :

: The P-39 was indeed designed as a fighter, but switched over to a ground attack role due to a lucky combination of her defects (slow, bad turn rate) and her assets (heavy nose canon, ability to take abuse).
: And I didn't mean to insult the P-40; hell, I love the looks of that beast. And she saved our proverbial bacon for the lone simple fact that you stated: she was all we had. Every source is clear, I'm afraid. The P-40 was an all-around unimpressive aircraft.
: Cheerio, pip pip!
: -graml

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

I beg to differ on the design intentions of the P-39. It was designed largely with ground attack in mind, as was the P-40 to a lesser extent. A point lost is what an excellent ground attack plane the P-40 was. The P-40 was better suited for fighter duty than the P-39 obviously. Still, there was a Russian ace with over 40 air to air combat kills done largely in P-39's. P-40's were flown in North Africa by both the British and us. German aces that flew against them have stated that the P-40's maneuverability astounded them. The roles were different against the German's. The German's would dive on them in 190's and 109's. If they weren't careful, the P-40's could get right on their tales. The German's could outdive them initially, but if it was a longer dive, the P-40 could catch up and overtake them. The fact that the P-40 was so fast in a dive proves that it never hit it's aerodynamic limit. The designer of the plane was always looking to give it a better engine than the Allison and a better supercharger, but the Army-Airforce and Curtiss saw now need to update it. This drove him to quit Curtiss out of disgust. One of the fighter groups in North Africa had a 7-1 kill ratio in P-40's against good German planes and pilots. The AVG had something like a 23-1 kill ratio. That doesn't sound unimpressive to me. Cheers

Follow Ups:

Let's agree to disagree. - graml 7:01am 02/22/2003

Re: Let's agree to disagree. - Rundquist 6:37pm 02/23/2003

Hey now! - Steppenwolf 5:41pm 02/22/2003

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: : The P-39 was indeed designed as a fighter, but switched over to a ground attack role due to a lucky combination of her defects (slow, bad turn rate) and her assets (heavy nose canon, ability to take abuse). : : And I didn't mean to insult the P-40; hell, I love the looks of that beast. And she saved our proverbial bacon for the lone simple fact that you stated: she was all we had. Every source is clear, I'm afraid. The P-40 was an all-around unimpressive aircraft. : : Cheerio, pip pip! : : -graml : : xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx : I beg to differ on the design intentions of the P-39. It was designed largely with ground attack in mind, as was the P-40 to a lesser extent. A point lost is what an excellent ground attack plane the P-40 was. The P-40 was better suited for fighter duty than the P-39 obviously. Still, there was a Russian ace with over 40 air to air combat kills done largely in P-39's. P-40's were flown in North Africa by both the British and us. German aces that flew against them have stated that the P-40's maneuverability astounded them. The roles were different against the German's. The German's would dive on them in 190's and 109's. If they weren't careful, the P-40's could get right on their tales. The German's could outdive them initially, but if it was a longer dive, the P-40 could catch up and overtake them. The fact that the P-40 was so fast in a dive proves that it never hit it's aerodynamic limit. The designer of the plane was always looking to give it a better engine than the Allison and a better supercharger, but the Army-Airforce and Curtiss saw now need to update it. This drove him to quit Curtiss out of disgust. One of the fighter groups in North Africa had a 7-1 kill ratio in P-40's against good German planes and pilots. The AVG had something like a 23-1 kill ratio. That doesn't sound unimpressive to me. Cheers

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